0:01

foreign

0:03

this is work in progress an exploratory

0:06

Gallery podcast where you will hear from

0:08

artists staff collaborators and even

0:11

different hosts as you follow along and

0:14

listen to each episode I’m Kimmy Craig

0:16

guest curator for the art gallery of

0:19

Greater Victoria’s blueprints for the

0:20

after future programming series and your

0:23

host for the day this episode is being

0:26

recorded and produced on the traditional

0:28

lands of the loquingan speaking peoples

0:30

also known as songhis and Esquimalt

0:33

Nations

0:34

in this episode we will reflect on some

0:37

of the questions that we asked artists

0:39

and community members to ponder

0:41

throughout this year-long series such as

0:43

why is the act of gathering so important

0:46

where are the places where we can

0:48

connect

0:49

how do we connect our various

0:51

communities

0:52

what kinds of spaces do we need

0:55

how do we learn about and support local

0:57

black presence and experiences building

1:00

on the work of artist Denise tomasos

1:02

whose paintings speak to the experience

1:04

of the African diaspora and were

1:06

previously on view at the agtv from

1:09

December 11 2021 to March 13 2022 this

1:15

series resulted in a number of

1:17

collaborations with black artists and

1:19

collectives from across BC folks like

1:22

Charles Campbell Justine a Chambers

1:24

Joshua genda Angie Riley DJ Nova Jade

1:29

hidden variable sound Collective Ruby

1:32

Smith Diaz Karen aka DJ joki joki and I

1:36

averse generously created art and

1:39

offerings that spoke to the importance

1:41

of recognizing blackness in BC which

1:44

eventually inspired portal to the afro

1:46

future an immersive celebration of Music

1:49

and Dance that took place on February

1:51

3rd 2023 our hope is that this podcast

1:55

episode will help extend the learning

1:58

that happened through this unique

1:59

program and be a way to share the

2:01

creative ideas and art and offerings

2:03

more broadly with family friends and

2:06

communities might want to learn more

2:10

the title blueprints for the afro future

2:14

actually came from a conversation with

2:18

Chief curator Jamie Isaac where she was

2:21

expressing her reaction to the work of

2:24

Denise tomasus and in it she was saying

2:28

how

2:29

the work how Denise’s work was able to

2:35

capture hope even though Denise is

2:38

talking about these institutions of

2:41

repression and she said that they the

2:46

work the paintings looked like

2:48

blueprints for the afro future and I

2:51

thought that would be a lovely title for

2:53

a series of programming so the artists

2:57

would have an opportunity

2:59

to create this

3:02

um idea of like what does the afrofuture

3:05

sound like what does it look like what

3:07

does it feel like

3:09

and so the idea was that the work that

3:11

people created it wouldn’t stop and end

3:14

with

3:16

the offering that they made but rather

3:18

it would be something that is a design

3:20

that we could take forward into the

3:22

future and this idea of continuation is

3:26

also how the name of the celebration of

3:31

the programming series portal to the

3:33

afro future came about because there was

3:36

an idea that we weren’t concluding we

3:39

weren’t ending anything but rather we

3:41

wanted something that was moving into

3:45

the next phase of this idea these

3:48

expressions of the afrofuture

3:51

part of the inspiration for blueprints

3:55

of the afrofuture and the way that it

3:57

was programmed was a desire to Showcase

4:00

some of the local artists that were of

4:04

the African diaspora because the

4:07

experience of Blackness in these

4:10

territories

4:11

is quite unique in terms of the context

4:14

of Blackness and other parts of Turtle

4:17

Island and Denise tomasus’s work

4:22

stemmed from the context of being in

4:26

larger cities more urban environments

4:29

and here

4:32

black communities we tend to operate

4:35

almost more in silos and so we were

4:38

seeking this way of connecting the

4:41

various communities and and find how do

4:44

we find out about the work that each

4:45

other is doing how do we find out about

4:50

um

4:51

how we can collaborate and what our

4:54

different skills are and where

4:56

opportunities of connection of

4:59

collaboration and skill sharing

5:02

um and just also places to gather and

5:06

one of the most moving experiences for

5:09

me about being at the portal to the

5:12

afrofuture was looking around the space

5:14

and seeing how much joy and in

5:17

particular like how much black Joy there

5:19

was in the room

5:21

um

5:21

the ability to come together and and

5:25

celebrate and dance and and hear

5:30

and experience art that is made by us

5:33

and and that centers our experiences

5:36

is a very unique

5:39

um experience for me and I think others

5:41

like me here in Victoria

5:44

I would love to speak a little bit to an

5:47

example of some of the artists that are

5:50

working here in BC but didn’t know about

5:52

each other but are complete powerhouses

5:55

and that was part of the

5:57

inspiration to bring Justine a Chambers

6:00

together with Charles Campbell so that

6:03

they could interview each other as

6:04

artists

6:06

um both have a performance practice and

6:10

a practice with working through the body

6:12

with working through time memory the

6:16

body is an archive

6:17

this idea of moving through the context

6:22

of past present and future

6:24

simultaneously and

6:27

because Justine lives and works in

6:30

Vancouver and Charles lives and works

6:34

here in Victoria

6:35

but also they work in different mediums

6:39

Justine is a contemporary dancer in

6:42

Vancouver and Charles

6:44

works

6:46

across Canada at this point but much of

6:49

his work happens in the visual arts

6:53

realm and so often

6:56

between the different disciplines

6:58

artists may not know about each other

7:01

and so it was so lovely to bring the two

7:04

of them together and to watch how that

7:06

relationship will grow and I hope that

7:09

in the future they may work together or

7:11

collaborate

7:13

and similarly the DJs that played the

7:16

closing event

7:18

DJ Nova Jade who actually opened the

7:21

series as well and opened the series

7:24

with a virtual experience

7:28

um and then was able to be here in

7:31

person for uh the portal event where

7:36

she was able to connect with like there

7:39

were different generations of DJs that

7:41

were playing that night and that was

7:42

really lovely to see

7:45

I would almost say that in terms of what

7:47

artists shared with me after the

7:50

experience and after

7:52

sharing the art that they created

7:55

that in some ways is surprising is that

7:58

for some of them it was one of the first

8:03

times that they were able to be

8:06

showcased in a gallery

8:10

um context

8:11

um some of them are are kind of like

8:16

senior artists in in the landscape of

8:20

like the art world and working in

8:22

galleries

8:24

um like Justine and and

8:26

Charles and

8:29

um

8:30

I’d say Josh gender to a certain extent

8:34

as well

8:36

um but some of the artists like Angie

8:38

Riley

8:40

as well as Ruby Smith Diaz even though

8:43

they’ve been doing a lot of really

8:44

profound work and Community you know

8:47

have have authored

8:51

books that were

8:53

um published as well as

8:57

um had kind of

9:00

who I put it had kind of

9:06

the the experience of being able to

9:10

facilitate in community

9:13

um for some like Ruby Smith Diaz it was

9:16

her first time presenting in a gallery

9:18

and and so for me that was a real gift

9:22

because I’ve seen some of the artists

9:25

work develop over years and it’s nice

9:28

that as a guest curator that’s being

9:31

invited in that’s like from the

9:33

communities that you want to Center then

9:36

being able to say hey they’re actually

9:39

all these hidden gems in the communities

9:41

how do we give their work a wider

9:47

audience and like how do we show like

9:50

um

9:51

more folks in in communities that

9:55

actually there are artists that that

9:58

like look like you and me that are doing

10:01

incredible work in community and here’s

10:03

an opportunity to come and see them

10:06

um Nicole stanbridge who is the former

10:10

curator of Engagement

10:13

basically invited me in and said what

10:17

what would you like to do we’d like you

10:20

to do something that’s in response and

10:22

in relationship to Denise’s work and

10:27

what are your ideas and what are your

10:29

thoughts about like what you would like

10:31

to do in terms of programming the series

10:33

and I think

10:36

for myself as an artist and also like I

10:39

was just sharing with

10:42

Jamie Isaac that my first kind of

10:47

experience in the art world was a

10:50

program called uh curatorial incubator

10:53

that was offered through the Western

10:55

Front and it was for me emerging

10:59

curators to have an opportunity to be

11:02

matched with a mentor

11:04

and there’s something for me about

11:07

having that experience of being an

11:11

emerging artist or curator that’s

11:14

partnered with someone that has the

11:16

skill set that you need to develop and

11:19

the experiences that you want to learn

11:21

from and I think

11:26

I it’s not so much that I saw myself

11:28

necessarily as a mentor but I saw myself

11:31

as someone who had the opportunity to

11:34

share space

11:35

and knowing that there’s so much talent

11:38

here it was an easy kind of like of

11:42

course these are the people that I would

11:44

like to share space with

11:47

the way that I got my start I often

11:50

dreamed of being

11:52

an artist I actually initially I wanted

11:56

to be a filmmaker because I saw this

11:59

film from Robert Townsend called

12:01

Hollywood Shuffle

12:03

where it features these actors that are

12:07

living in Hollywood

12:08

and they were also black and they were

12:13

talking about how they wanted to go and

12:15

audition for roles where they got to

12:16

play the superhero or you know the kind

12:20

of like

12:22

person that solves the mystery but the

12:24

rules that they were getting cast in

12:26

were these like really problematic

12:27

stereotypical roles and it was the first

12:31

time that I saw a film that really

12:35

reflected my experience like there was I

12:39

often felt like I was trying to brush up

12:41

against this narrative

12:43

of me that was in place before I even

12:46

arrived and so

12:50

initially I wanted to be a filmmaker but

12:53

I was living

12:55

in South Carolina and went to an art

12:58

gallery in Charleston where Lorna

13:00

Simpsons work was being featured and

13:03

before that I didn’t really understand

13:04

or really connect with Contemporary Art

13:08

I liked some more

13:10

um

13:12

well I won’t go with what I I just I I

13:15

didn’t quite understand

13:19

abstraction and I didn’t understand a

13:21

lot of contemporary work like it didn’t

13:23

really land with me until I saw Lorna

13:27

Simpson’s work and that’s where I was

13:29

like I I completely felt

13:33

seen and that

13:37

the way that she

13:40

positioned things like hair pieces and

13:43

the angles that she used in photography

13:45

I just found really

13:48

um

13:50

inspiring really intriguing and

13:53

something clicked and I was like that’s

13:55

what I want to do I want to become an

13:56

artist So eventually I did go to art

14:01

school but I started by just kind of

14:04

volunteering at a local film Co-op and

14:08

from there got a little experience

14:10

making Super Eight films and taking

14:12

workshops in community

14:14

and I used that for

14:17

my portfolio to go to art school and

14:20

when I went to school it seemed like the

14:23

first thing that they did was everyone

14:25

that had a more traditional medium or a

14:28

more conventional medium whether it be

14:30

painting or film

14:32

their whole thing was like well how what

14:35

can you do with that how can you break

14:37

out of that box and so it was also one

14:41

of the first times that I had to that I

14:44

had the experience of creating outside

14:48

these kind of like normative ways of

14:51

working

14:52

and so I got to learn about

14:56

um

14:57

things like expanded Cinema and

15:01

multimedia installation and how I could

15:04

combine both my love of dance and moving

15:08

with visual art and So currently I

15:13

combine things like analog film with

15:16

some newer media Technologies like

15:19

projection mapping as well as augmented

15:23

reality technology and I use that in

15:26

relationship to

15:27

movement and and projections and and

15:33

create both

15:35

um

15:37

site-specific performances as well as

15:40

installations and I’m looking

15:44

forward to like in my practice

15:45

developing even more immersive and more

15:50

engaged installations and performances

15:53

and experiences

15:55

but I would definitely say

15:58

being an interdisciplinary artist is

16:02

what

16:04

made my way of working I think as a

16:07

curator as well in programming the

16:10

series that it would be inter

16:12

interdisciplinary in nature as well

16:15

um

16:16

because I feel like in the real world we

16:19

experience things and in so many

16:22

different ways like the real world is a

16:24

multi-sensory experience and so I think

16:28

I often crave

16:30

um

16:32

that kind of like multi

16:36

uh sensorial experience also when when

16:39

I’m out in the world and I’m going to

16:41

shows and I think I want to share those

16:43

experiences with with others

16:48

in connecting with Ruby Smith Diaz after

16:52

the entire

16:54

um series was uh moving towards

16:58

celebration

17:00

one of the things that

17:02

she noted and picked up on was the

17:06

importance of accessibility being

17:09

centered in the afro future that without

17:13

accessibility and and this centering of

17:18

care and Community there is no

17:20

afrofuture and so

17:23

in terms of the development of the

17:25

program and and where we would like to

17:28

see things develop in the future and how

17:30

we like things to develop it was very

17:32

important to have both virtual our

17:35

offerings as well as in-person offerings

17:38

so that

17:40

um

17:41

people could feel safe and have

17:44

experiences that were empowering and

17:47

inspiring in the safety and the comfort

17:49

of their homes and

17:52

I think even in relationship to the

17:57

in-person

17:58

sessions like being able to have some of

18:01

the in-person components have live

18:03

elements so that people

18:06

um

18:07

had a window of access into the event

18:11

and I think also making sure that there

18:15

was content that that will continue to

18:20

exist on the website and on the page for

18:25

blueprints for the afro future so that

18:28

people can revisit these experiences

18:30

that may be

18:31

are not able to come out but have

18:35

different ways of accessing content and

18:39

I think another layer that I would love

18:41

that I’m in the process of learning

18:44

myself as an artist is for example audio

18:47

description so when you’re creating

18:49

visual work when you’re creating a

18:53

movement-based performance like how do

18:56

you add that other layer of access by

18:58

being able to you know poetically

19:01

describe what’s happening in this

19:03

performance like how a dancer is moving

19:05

what the visuals how they appear and and

19:10

so that there are different ways of

19:12

sensing and experience all of the

19:15

offerings and artwork being created

19:18

a question that I had

19:20

for myself and with this programming

19:24

was how

19:27

how can we as as the Greater Community

19:32

how can we support

19:35

um

19:36

an Elevate like black presence and black

19:39

experiences in our local communities and

19:45

one of the things that I appreciated was

19:48

first of all the invitation

19:50

uh because

19:52

that alone created it removed a barrier

19:57

of like trying to access

20:00

public spaces public institutions

20:04

um

20:05

and so I think the idea of

20:11

thinking or broadly about how

20:14

institutions and how

20:16

artists Galleries and other

20:21

public entities embedded in communities

20:24

can

20:27

be a part of

20:30

um

20:31

honoring black presence and black

20:34

experiences in

20:37

in the Greater Community

20:40

um

20:43

I think it’s important to remember this

20:47

idea of by us for us that it needs to be

20:52

someone that is actually embedded in

20:54

community that understands what needs

20:57

are and and you know black experiences

21:01

aren’t a monolith either and so

21:04

you know I know one tiny kind of corner

21:08

of experiences

21:10

uh but I do find that in being able to

21:15

at least connect with other people

21:18

um

21:21

it is important to have someone where

21:25

potentially there is like a shared

21:28

present day experience or

21:32

um even if it’s one from

21:35

from like stemming from your past or

21:38

like your your deeper cultural

21:40

experiences that is kind of like doing

21:44

the work and having that has the lens of

21:49

the nuances of what’s Happening locally

21:54

um because it’s always good to start

21:58

right where you are before you’re

22:01

branching out into larger pictures

22:02

because starting right where you are is

22:04

informing is a part of that informing of

22:07

a larger picture and and working the

22:10

other way around like the the big

22:13

picture is also informing kind of what’s

22:15

happening in these

22:18

um

22:18

like in smaller contexts and

22:22

so I would say

22:24

in a way when I mention the experience

22:27

that I had where

22:30

as someone that had

22:32

the interest and had the dream but

22:35

didn’t necessarily have an in into

22:39

spaces that

22:42

um have the gallery and have the space

22:44

and have the funding

22:47

um

22:48

to create more programs for people to

22:52

experience as as as an emerging

22:57

artist or an emerging curator to create

23:01

more experiences like that to develop

23:03

that within Community where people that

23:07

already have the the knowledge of

23:09

organizing events but

23:12

often gallery

23:14

Galleries and other institutions are

23:17

just speaking a different language and

23:19

so maybe if Galleries and other

23:21

institutions thought a little bit more

23:23

about how they can learn

23:26

um more fluidity in their language and

23:29

like the ability to understand that the

23:32

way that they speak is not

23:34

it’s not the only way of speaking it’s

23:36

not the only way of moving in community

23:39

and that they have just as much to learn

23:41

from community members as a community

23:45

member can share in that like

23:49

um that Loop of knowledge that can be

23:52

shared by

23:54

bringing someone in and saying like you

23:57

know here are ways that your work that

23:59

your artwork can can develop and go

24:02

further like have a broader reach and

24:06

that the work that is being created by

24:10

artists that the gallery is kind of

24:12

learning other ways of of working and

24:15

being in community like centering care

24:18

like centering process rather than just

24:22

a product and yeah

24:25

part of the reason that

24:28

this programming series that I was

24:31

really inspired to engage with this idea

24:35

of the afrofuture and you know and

24:37

there’s more than one future you know

24:39

there it’s futurism their futures

24:43

um futurities like it’s definitely

24:46

plural in in its experience

24:50

um

24:51

but I think what

24:52

for me I find so empowering is that

24:58

Notions of futurism and specifically

25:01

afrofuturism that imagine

25:05

um

25:06

Blackness as being embedded in a part of

25:09

the future

25:11

um what I find really exciting is that

25:14

there is a way of

25:19

you get to think outside of what already

25:22

is and create something new so I’m

25:26

really drawn to things like speculative

25:28

narrative science fiction fantasy things

25:32

like that because they allow you to take

25:36

your experience and really create this

25:38

whole other world and I had this history

25:41

Professor Dr Georgia satara and she said

25:46

you know we work she works a lot around

25:48

anti-racism anti-Semitism and I remember

25:52

in class are telling us she’s like you

25:54

know I know that we’re here and we’re

25:56

doing this work in activism and and you

26:00

know trying to end these things that are

26:02

problematic but if you don’t have the

26:04

ability to imagine a new world and what

26:07

that might look like

26:09

then what are you moving towards it’s

26:11

one thing to take something apart but

26:13

you need to be able to create what

26:15

you’re moving towards and so that was

26:18

kind of why I was so inspired and really

26:21

wanted to focus on afrofuturism and also

26:24

with

26:25

one of the things that I find unique

26:28

with

26:29

um

26:30

afrofuturism and Indigenous futurities

26:33

is that there is this honoring and

26:38

respect and understanding of the

26:41

knowledge of our ancestors and that is

26:46

brought into the future and also this

26:50

understanding of

26:53

time not happening in a linear sense but

26:57

time almost like being collapsed or

26:59

folded in on itself and you’re

27:01

experiencing past present future

27:04

simultaneously and so I’m really drawn

27:06

to artists that also kind of like

27:08

promote and amplify that idea

27:13

thank you so much for joining me and a

27:15

huge thank you to Charles Campbell

27:17

Justine a Chambers Joshua genda Angie

27:21

Riley DJ Nova Jade hidden variable sound

27:24

Collective Ruby Smith Diaz DJ jokey

27:27

jokey and Aya verse for contributing to

27:30

the programming

27:31

work in progress is programmed through

27:34

the art gallery of Greater Victoria in

27:36

Victoria BC mukwangan lands and is

27:39

generously supported by a Canada Council

27:42

for the Arts digital Now Grant

27:45

for those who want to learn more about

27:46

blueprints for the afrofuture visit

27:49

agd.ca

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