0:01

foreign we actually have a line that we do at our house we practice this thing what is

0:08

it

0:13

I’m eight years old I’m unarmed and I have nothing that will

0:20

hurt you

0:26

okay you ready [Music]

0:39

um the anti-black racism within our school

0:45

system can be measured in a number of ways but one of the most troubling examples is what’s referred to as the

0:51

school to prison pipeline that is when black youth face more discipline and harsher penalties in schools than white

0:58

students as a result it puts them in direct contact with law enforcement and

1:04

potentially sends them down the wrong path and through the justice system

1:10

[Music]

1:18

well I’d like to open with a territorial acknowledgment um we are gathered here today we’re

1:26

gathered virtually and so we’re kind of

1:31

operating today across I’m in space we’re in different areas I’m coming from

1:38

the liquid and wet Spanish territories and I think when I

1:43

think about something that I can do on a daily basis in order to support

1:51

indigenous Resurgence and sovereignty is

1:57

um try and learn things like place names but also even if I struggle to remember

2:03

the place names like one put the effort in but two also to know the

2:12

um translation so that I know what um Le quangan speaking peoples and

2:19

Central speaking peoples what was activated in this space and then now

2:25

kind of what’s also happening as a continuation of this labor that’s

2:30

happened from time immemorial and maybe I’ll let you introduce where you’re coming from today

2:37

yeah I’m joining virtually from the unseated territories of the musk

2:42

Williams what I know of this area is that there

2:48

are many many place names um all around the Lower Mainland and

2:53

umailum and I think each Nation also has maybe different variations of those

2:58

place names as well um so yeah very layered and

3:04

I think that for me what I know about the area that I that I work in

3:09

specifically is um Lotus Elder Amy George

3:17

what she shared with me is that it’s a burial site for her peoples

3:23

and I know that there is a relationship with the Squamish Nation among those

3:29

that specific portion of land and the requests for the city was that they

3:34

built a fence around the burial site and that request was never honored so it’s something I think about too where I work

3:41

spend the majority of my time in yes thank you so much thank you

3:48

um I am so excited to be here with you again today and have this opportunity to

3:55

um revisit our conversation how I kind of got to know you and your work and

4:02

then if you if they’re things that you’d like to introduce as well sure I was really drawn to your work as

4:10

an artist because you’re also a multi-disciplinary artist you work in

4:15

sound you also have a teaching artist practice where you do

4:21

uh kind of like this uh coupling that

4:27

crosses um time time kind of continuums or like

4:32

kind of recognizes the the way that time operates

4:39

simultaneously with past present and future all as as one happening and I was

4:46

really drawn to some of the drawings that you did and some of the work that you did with youth where you’re having

4:54

them um kind of learn about a historical figure

5:00

but then you’re also bringing them into these like very much like contemporary contexts and and

5:09

your methodology is also like the way that you’re

5:15

approaching doing the work is it’s multi-layered

5:20

um in terms of its different artistic approaches and disciplines and also that

5:27

it seemed to be a Common Thread in your work that it was very much

5:33

um rooted in social justice and then

5:38

amplifying voices of um Equity deserving communities and I I

5:45

felt like our practices aligned and as I kind of followed you throughout the

5:50

years and saw how you were also like beginning to share your independent

5:55

practice like outside of your your practice as a teaching artist an educator and so when the opportunity

6:05

to came about to invite different artists to work with the art gallery of Greater Victoria

6:12

um you were one of the first people that I thought of and I was really excited that you say yes that you said yes and

6:19

um the work that you made was so incredible is so incredible and so I’m

6:25

excited to be able to kind of like dig into that today and maybe you would like

6:33

to share a little bit about yourself and your kind of interest in doing the

6:38

project sure well first off thank you for those Reflections

6:44

um it means a lot to hear them from you because you’re also an artist that I really look up to and yeah I do find

6:51

that the way that we work um with different mediums is very similar and it’s yeah just really neat

6:58

to also meet somebody who is working with other groups of people and young people

7:04

um to create things which is not always an intersection that you come across of artists and then also facilitating

7:11

artists as well so yeah my practice I I love the way that you summed it up

7:18

in terms of finding the intersections of past present and future

7:23

um and also really centering the stories of folks that have been historically marginalized and left out from

7:30

narratives around how we’ve come to arrive to this land how we were brought to these lands kidnapped to these lands

7:37

um and also just the different forces at play I think a large part of that comes through my

7:44

identity and for myself I’m an afro-latina person my lineage comes from

7:51

South America from Chile Juan mapu territories Spanish ancestry

7:57

um and the other half of my lineage comes from Jamaica and the lands of erawak and Taino peoples and maroon

8:04

ancestry African ancestry on that side and for me growing up in miscuichi 3d6

8:10

colonial colonially knows it known as Edmonton um

8:15

that was an experience that I never really got to fully immerse myself in in

8:21

terms of really reflecting on my own identity and what it meant to be at the

8:26

intersections of those cultures um nor did I ever see myself reflected in the curriculum when I grew up in in

8:33

Edmonton um and so a lot of that actually came into fruition in my early 20s

8:40

um as I entered University as I also just stepped out of the schooling system

8:46

and explored the world for myself and one of the things that really opened the doors for me was volunteering at an

8:53

arts-based Youth Camp and using my education degree and thinking about it and thinking about the ways that I felt

9:00

that it lacked connection it lacked depth into just like everything that

9:06

youth experience and go through and envision and when I attended that as a volunteer it just totally broke me open

9:12

and and I realized that everybody is an artist everybody has some sort of

9:18

creative element to their lives and I guess it just kind of helped me hone my practice as an

9:26

arts-based facilitator and and also use popular education

9:32

as a way to connect people towards each other’s experiences and also think about the ways that we can also affect future

9:39

not just uh focusing on what has happened in the past and what’s facing us but how can we actually actively

9:45

proactively think about how we determine our futures as well yes beautifully put

9:52

thank you so much yeah in terms of like moving into the work there was something

9:57

that you you’re speaking to your lineage and then your experience growing up in

10:04

what’s known as Colonial colonially known as Edmonton I’m

10:10

thinking about the work that you created and how the two of us

10:17

um have roots in the we’re a part of the African diaspora but you know very

10:22

different lineages like my ancestors the ones that I

10:28

um know of uh I grew up between the Cherokee and Catawba territories that is

10:36

also colonially known as North in South Carolina and like specifically between the the

10:44

mountains and the Foothills and my family goes back for

10:51

six seven generations or more in that area and

10:58

before that I’m I’m not sure but what I find so interesting is that even though

11:04

we have these different threads um the the work that you created very

11:11

much spoke to um a unifying experience and

11:17

you know when I talk about that not only when you’re speaking to

11:23

uh systemic violence but also when you’re speaking to Joy when you’re

11:30

speaking you um when you’re calling it yamaya and then when you’re talking about

11:37

um like Christine sharp has this positioning of kind of like the African

11:45

diasporic experience like being born in the waters of the Atlantic and I think

11:52

that’s in her book in the wake and so I think about your the threads that we have and also

11:59

the threads that are in the work that you created and I’m wondering would you like to describe a little bit

12:07

um the work and and how you came to create it and that really layered manner

12:13

oh there’s a lot to unpack there and just noticing sorry sorry Start anywhere yeah

12:22

um I’m just noticing my own reaction to you as you shared when you’re reflecting on your own lineages as far as I know as

12:29

far as I know of my ancestors and it’s like just that just hit me and it always hits

12:35

me of like how so many of us are the African diaspora we we can’t actually fully Trace back in so many cases

12:42

because that’s something else that’s been stolen from us and and there’s a grief there at least for me there is a

12:47

grief there to not ever know to look at this giant continent and be like somewhere

12:53

yes at some point I was from there I don’t I have no idea from where and just

12:59

just such a sadness for me around that yes um

13:04

yeah and I think maybe that is subconsciously

13:10

and at times consciously like a thread through all my work and when I guess I look at

13:15

um the theme of displacement I think it’s a common theme for so many people across

13:22

the world around how all of our stories in some way or another Connect into displacement whether we have the one are

13:28

the ones that have been displaced or our families have or we are the ones that are actively doing the displacing or

13:34

historically have at some point or another and I think it’s important to examine those histories and um

13:41

yeah in this piece in particular in the soundscape that I created I wanted a way to invite

13:49

people into a corner of my world um of the thoughts that run through my

13:56

head on any given day as I as I walk around um the city

14:01

um and I noticed within myself that I was stumped for a little while around the

14:09

theme of future and you know the prompt of blueprints for an afro future and

14:14

despite my work being really focused on it for myself to reflect on it and to

14:20

not guide a collective process around it where I’m kind of listening to what the voices around me are saying

14:27

um I noticed myself be stumped and and wonder about like what what is what is

14:32

future what is future for black communities in particular what are we building towards and

14:39

you know there’s so much of that that I think the big reason of why I’m

14:44

stumped is because that has been something that historically that imagining that envisioning has been

14:50

historically taken away from our communities and when I think about again

14:55

the the the connecting thread around displacement I think about specifically

15:00

the papal bull and how that document um in the late 1400s set in motion

15:07

um the colonization of essentially any lands that weren’t European um any lands that weren’t Christian

15:13

which was the global majority at that that point in time and how it also enabled the theft of human beings

15:21

specifically so many millions from the African continent and so I think when I when I

15:27

came across a prompt I I’ve started connecting all of these pieces around you know the ones that

15:35

were stolen from across the water that at some point that’s where my lineage comes from

15:41

um and I wanted to speak to that in the piece and I thought about all of those

15:46

that didn’t make it um that you know even on their their

15:51

Journeys making it to the departure points where people were brought on board that a lot of people

15:58

um collapsed and didn’t make that journey and how many people uh passed away on those ships because of

16:05

the conditions that they were carried in and how many people also jumped off as a form of resistance as a way of like you

16:10

will never enslave me you will never control my future and that was a big piece that I wanted

16:17

to be included in that is those acts of resistance and placing

16:23

all of these threads through time and space and also bringing us into the present now and for me now is when I

16:29

think literally about future it’s the kids that I work with it’s the young people that I work with they are the

16:35

Next Generation Um especially when I’m working with high school kids it’s like I see that turn around happening within five years of of

16:42

people taking that knowledge and and doing something with it but um I really wanted to focus on the

16:48

younger voices of the children in and around the involvement with me in some

16:53

way or another in my life or through community and I thought that their voices were

17:00

really important to Center in this soundscape

17:05

as well as those voices and naming the names of the people who are no longer

17:10

with us due to Colonial violence due to police violence and white supremacist violence and we can’t have conversations

17:18

about future if we’re not also talking about the factors the systems the policing

17:26

forces that endanger our lives every single day that literally take our lives away from us that take community members

17:32

away from us that incarcerate us and that that threat also needed to be

17:37

included when I thought about future because it’s like how do we talk about future and how do we protect future

17:44

at the same time yes how do we ensure a future for ourselves and communities yeah yeah

17:52

that’s it’s beautiful and you also wrote

17:58

you wrote a poem but you also there’s um they’re singing or like a humming in it

18:06

as well as laughter and I was wondering if you could um maybe talk about some of the the

18:14

layers so you have the the voices of the youth and you have the names

18:20

that are being repeated um and you also like have these other

18:26

sound elements in it and I’m I’m just curious as to what your process was

18:33

around including the humming and including the

18:38

um because the way it all worked together um and the way that you experience it is

18:44

incredibly powerful and I found that it hit kind of different parts of my body all

18:51

at once you know but also like it just it had a way of

18:57

of coming in through all of these different access points and I want to talk a little bit about that like the

19:05

laughter the the humming the poem

19:11

yeah um so many points of Entry like you said I

19:18

I think the one of the main threads that the the soundscape starts with is with

19:23

the voice of Robin Maynard and as she lists the names of the people that have

19:29

been killed in police interactions um in so-called Canada in the last decade and

19:35

um that was something that was like I mentioned before really important to ground ourselves in is this conversation

19:41

about future acknowledging that there’s so many that we’ve already lost and

19:47

in conversation with that and contradiction with that in a way are the

19:52

voices of children um kind of chattering laughing playing

19:59

and that was an invitation that I made and I extended out to

20:04

um friends of mine of the African diaspora to just record a moment of play

20:10

wherever they may spontaneously find it in their lives

20:15

um and layered underneath that is um yeah the sound of the Kalimba and for

20:23

folks who don’t know Columba is an instrument that’s indigenous to the African continent and um I can’t fully

20:29

say that I’m fully proficient in it but um I do go through periods of time where I just play with it and kind of just get

20:36

lost in a little bit of a trance little Melody and was playing around with it and started just laying

20:43

um it down on my Looper and just kind of vocally improvising over it to see what

20:49

would come out and layering my own voice harmonizing with it and then just kind of sat with it and and noticed What

20:57

feelings came out for me and um within that I started layering all

21:03

those different components and and yeah I think one of the biggest pieces

21:10

that that at the beginning especially just really Jarred me and that I I noticed and I I get emotional almost

21:16

every single time is a specific clip from a video that was recorded about

21:22

four years ago in the US and it’s the voice of a little girl um Ariel Sky Williams who is talking to

21:30

her dad about what she does um to practice any interactions with

21:36

police that she may have even as a young girl she’s eight years old and hearing her voice and then hearing

21:42

the laughter and hearing the humming and like this almost like lullaby the

21:47

soundscape was something that just completely transformed the piece for me

21:54

and and helped open the pathways of where I wanted to take it really because it has this um

22:03

this to be both heartbreaking

22:09

um and it it just resonates you know so

22:14

it’s so real like yes that is the experience these are the conversations that are being had between parent and

22:21

and child you know yeah I don’t think also that that people

22:28

who are non-black think about and and that was something that I wanted to bring in because there comes a point

22:33

where we read statistics we see the media we see the headlines of people being lost of such and such police

22:39

interaction or you know uh white supremacist violence incident

22:46

but but we never know the other side of it of what it actually means to

22:52

grow up with that and grow up with having to set certain protocols or teach

22:59

your kids certain things so that they will survive in this world and that to me was an important window to bring also

23:06

non-black listeners into the piece and into the experiences that so many of our

23:11

communities go through and have gone through yes yes no that’s it’s

23:16

incredibly powerful and just that acknowledgment that even if you are not

23:22

necessarily the to die by this violence like there is

23:29

something that is continually being shaped and reshaped you know like you’re

23:35

you’re constantly um navigating and um

23:41

and rather than being able to focus on

23:47

um how the world can support like you’re

23:52

also needing to navigate and these are the systems that

23:58

are designed to to end my existence like to end what I have to offer this world

24:05

and like yeah and so foreign

24:12

[Music] directly it is indirectly and

24:18

and directly even if it’s not physical like it’s it’s shaping you so thank you for that

24:26

um another question that I had was you know

24:31

if there’s something that you really want people that listen to your soundscape and experience the work

24:39

um what it is you’re hoping will land with with folks or if that’s completely

24:45

open maybe you don’t have a I mean I do feel that it’s it’s pretty

24:52

open and again the reason that I I wanted to to

24:57

go with soundscape because I I really do see the possibility for certain

25:04

um elements to hit you in different ways and depending on where you’re at or what

25:10

you’re thinking about or what your point of connection is um you’re going to be paying attention to

25:16

certain parts more than others and I think that’s okay and

25:21

um and at the same time I wanted people to understand that

25:30

these things are always relevant to communities of the African diaspora

25:35

whether it be black history month or not um or whether it be

25:41

the next time an incident of white supremacist violence or police involved shooting happens

25:48

um it’s it’s always within our community these things that we have to navigate

25:53

these barriers and these these threats to our lives that we have to navigate and

25:59

I think for me I wanted people to also carry that in their hearts still

26:06

because what I’ve seen happen and in conversation with another member of the community who was a young person through

26:14

the LA riots and saw this cycle of people feeling mobilized people feeling

26:21

like they wanted systemic change to happen that no more violence against black people that systems needed to

26:28

change and and the feeling of Hope and momentum and seeing that same cycle happen again with the murder of George

26:34

Floyd and and two three years later we’re seeing that same kind of movement

26:41

dwindle and if not go back to exactly the place where they were prior to his to his death go back even

26:48

maybe to a place where we’re even more in danger because a lot of people have a

26:54

sense that things have changed when they actually haven’t and so I think for me I wanted to leave people

27:00

in their awareness of these are children that we’re talking about these are the next generation of young ones of people

27:08

that are going to go out into the world um and change the world potentially but they need to have their survival insured

27:16

and and that needs to happen through focusing resources on you know the lives

27:22

of black kids it needs to happen through um protecting their Futures and looking

27:29

at things that structurally um put them in places of harm that

27:34

structurally put them in places where they’re more likely to be involved as police or not have enough supports

27:40

around mental health um all of these things I want people to to understand that uh it’s it carries it

27:49

carries Beyond just the month or the headline um or the Year yes yeah and there’s a

27:55

lot of work to be done in that and it’s always immediate yes exactly I think about you know when you

28:02

mention um creating these safer spaces for Youth

28:07

and um and notice that I received from my teenagers school where they’re

28:15

you know really uh fighting to have a

28:21

police at the school and

28:26

and how we’re like that is absolutely the last thing that we need you know

28:32

what I mean like that is that is not how we begin taking these systems apart that

28:38

is again like it is cementing a system that is problematic and deadly

28:45

you know so thank you for mentioning um yeah and I’ll just add do something

28:52

that I was reflecting on the other day is that music has always been uh means for our communities to

28:59

come together and organize and talk about the issues facing us and

29:04

um I even think about the conjugly riots in Trinidad that started because too many people started drumming

29:11

um and that drumming also brought together communities of African descent and also South Asian communities

29:16

together and talk about the conditions that they were working on and working in

29:22

and forced to work in and talking about freedom and I’m also thinking about

29:27

pretty much in every single genre that um people of African diaspora create

29:33

musically there is always a thread going back to the impact of policing on our lives and I would argue that there’s

29:40

maybe no other genre by predominantly like non-black folks that have that same thread I was

29:48

thinking about you know songs about like old folk songs that still talk about the impact of policing in our lives and

29:54

thinking about reggae songs um that talk about that same impact blues songs and it just makes you think

30:01

for a second I’m just like I would be hard-pressed to find another genre from non-black artists that that carry

30:07

that same thread for as long as as we’ve had to carry it for exactly yeah

30:14

um because I don’t often get to share in public spaces the desires that we have

30:21

for ourselves and our own lives and there’s a Storyteller uh hallease by the

30:28

name hallease named after her grandmother and she’s a pretty popular YouTuber and does a lot of adobe

30:37

um like she had an artist in Residence with Adobe Creative as well as uh

30:43

teaches a number of workshops on skillshare and she said the way that she got into

30:49

um youtubing and and filmmaking storytelling was because she knew that

30:54

if she didn’t tell her own story there was a possibility that someone else was telling the stories for her she

31:02

was kind of specifically thinking about Sandra Bland because she was also in Texas at that time and so I’m asking you

31:10

personally what is it that you want for your future

31:16

yeah that’s a great question um I think the first thing that comes to

31:21

mind because of that quote is um I want to write a book

31:26

um I want to write a book rewrite a book about the life of seraphim Fortes and um

31:33

and so actually it could have really been thinking about too uh an Audrey Lord is my reference point to that the

31:39

same idea of like you know so it wasn’t for me writing I’d be crunched into other people’s imaginings and desires

31:47

um and yes absolutely is that something that I’d like to do I’d also am

31:55

gonna some way figure out a place for myself and my partner and my mama who’s

32:01

aging to live together and have solid housing um which is which is so foundational to

32:08

be able to have that security to work from to create to support others from

32:16

and I would love to just focus a little bit more inwards on my own art and

32:24

creativity in the next while um still immersed with you know the

32:30

physical training the body positive training that I do um for for others and also for myself

32:37

um but also I would like to see myself shift more into my own work in this next uh kind of span of time

32:44

um more specifically because what I what I realized actually around the time of the murder of George Floyd was that I

32:51

was putting in all of my resources to educate and create change which I needed to do and I felt that I needed to do at

32:58

that time um and not realizing also the impact that it was having on my spirit and the

33:05

impact that it was also having on my body as somebody living with as and like already prone to stress inflammation and

33:12

realizing too that when I talk about these heavy topics when I hold these heavy topics in my body and help others

33:18

work through which there is a lot of value and need for but I also carry that home in my body and it lives with me and

33:25

so it was actually since then that I’ve started shifting more into my own arts practice and working more with youth

33:31

um and yeah I’d like to see myself continue more of that creation reflection process for myself in in the

33:39

next while thank you may I ask

33:44

what is maybe one thing that this world could do to support you

33:53

[Music] um I think a really great way to support me

33:58

would be to support my work um online and virtually and share my

34:03

work and this is huge because what’s happening to a lot of black and fat and

34:10

queer content creators is that we are getting censored through Instagram and other social media platforms

34:16

um and slight tangent but I noticed actually the other day when I looked at my least interacted with accounts that

34:23

were actually all black run accounts um that I would love to see more of in

34:28

my feed but I’m not seeing any of it and so that’s a really great way that people can share to follow stay updated turn on

34:35

your notifications for my posts on Tierra negative arts on Instagram autonomy ybr on Instagram and stay tuned

34:42

with my website as well um and also like I’m I’m not shy about also receiving donations if you’re

34:49

feeling like you know I just really want to support this person in whatever way that they see fit and in terms of buying

34:57

a coffee for that person or maybe this enables you to take a step closer towards your homework or anything like

35:03

that or getting a nice like physio treatment or something I’m I’m game for that and I think those are the most

35:09

meaningful ways to support me at this point in time thank you thank you to speaking thank you for speaking to your

35:16

needs and your desires and thank you so much for the beautiful work that you

35:23

create and put out into the world thank you I actually just thought of

35:29

something the piece ends with an affirmation that the children are all

35:35

saying out loud um and so when I listen to it it brings me to tears to to hear them saying it’s

35:42

so confidently and just putting that out into their bodies into the world

35:49

um and that for me was so important because it’s it’s the voices of

35:56

um African diaspora Youth and it was their voice it was their voices being

36:01

recorded after we had read a book by Mariam Kaba together that talks about

36:06

the impacts of incarceration disproportionately on the black indigenous communities and after reading

36:13

that storybook they had been sitting with these feelings of deep sadness as

36:18

one of the children expressed and were very quiet and reflective and for me as

36:24

a facilitator I didn’t want to leave them with that and I thought ahead of how do we also shift this and get them

36:31

to recognize their own genius and their own magic and you know their own Supreme

36:37

beingness and I thought immediately about affirmation work and so that piece

36:43

was really important to carry us into future of that affirmation being spoken

36:48

by the Next Generation into future and that’s exactly what they’re going to be

36:54

beautiful loved blessed and free and

36:59

yeah it’s a beautiful affirmation from another fellow African diaspora artist

37:04

so yeah yes no thank you because that that is

37:11

um such a critical part of the experience or participant so again thank you so

37:18

much yeah yeah absolutely well I will end this here but I hope

37:24

that you have um an incredible

37:29

Year and that that everything that you are just like calling in and speaking to

37:36

existence that the ancestors are listening and The Descendants are listening and they’re carrying your

37:43

hopes your dreams and desires um into this world where we all get to

37:50

experience them alongside you um thank you thanks so much Kim

37:58

beautiful

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